Six decades on since the slaughter of World War II and the Nazi holocaust, the events of the 1930s and 1940s continue to haunt us. By warping our memory of the Shoah (the Hebrew word for the Holocaust), those who seek to use memory as a bludgeon miss the stark, vital message of the Holocaust and its heroes - those who displayed uncommon moral courage in the face of evil.

Holocaust blindspot

Too many Muslim and Arab intellectuals and leaders continue to fail in adequately addressing the Nazi holocaust and its implications for today in meaningful, humanitarian terms. Two recent examples include the Muslim Council of Britain's daft refusal to participate in Britain's annual Holocaust Memorial Day and the public indulgence in Holocaust revisionism and labeling of the Nazi holocaust as "myth" by Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood chief Muhammad Akef. Deep-seated, knee-jerk anti-Zionism and the continuing occupation of Palestine have unfortunately blinded many Arabs and Muslims to the historical reality and legacy of the Nazi holocaust.

An intelligent and compassionate regard for the victims of the Nazi holocaust - Jews, Gypsies, Slavs, the disabled, and others - on the part of contemporary Muslims is critical for preserving ethical and communal integrity, for a just resolution of the Palestinian question and for the future - if there is to be one - of Western Muslims. Instead, the Holocaust remains a historical blindspot in Arab and Muslim discourse, and as a result it has become a potent political weapon to be exploited at will by those who view Palestinians and Muslims as enemies.

Holocaust blame

A growing chorus of voices has been trying to smear Muslims - and Arabs in particular - with grand accusations of complicity in the Holocaust and support for the Nazis. These voices serve hawkish interests who wish to justify and legitimize continued war, violence, and yes - even genocide. Identifying Muslims with and as Nazis eases the task of selling continued bloodshed to war-weary publics. Reading the books, op-eds, and blogs of the smearers, one could almost conclude absurdly that the Nazi holocaust was an Arab Muslim and not a European Christian project. As evidence, the smearers usually trot out the pro-German Mufti of Jerusalem Amin Al-Husayni and the Bosnian Muslim SS "Handschar" division.

What these would-be historians, who even include Muslims, don't like to tell you: the Muslim role in World War II was much bigger and positive than the stories of the Mufti and the Bosnian division. The "Mufti" was actually an appointee of the Jewish administrator of British Palestine who completed one measly year at Al-Azhar and betrayed the Ottoman Sultan to join the British. A marginal figure, he accepted Hitler's hospitality in the naive hope that Hitler would eject the British from his homeland and grant the Arabs independence. To fool Arabs and Muslims into support for the German cause against their British rulers, the Nazis actually omitted Hitler's true dark vision for Arabs and Muslims from Arabic versions of Mein Kampf.

The much-vaunted Bosnian "Hanschar" SS division - disbanded after a few months due to mass desertions - was the only SS division ever to mutiny. The Nazis had hoped the Hanschar division would re-kindle the Bosnian-German alliance from World War One, which would have given the Nazis a force to counter Croatian and Serbian nationalism. However, to reduce the discussion of Muslims in the former Yugoslavia during World War II to the Hanschar division is highly simplistic. Bosnian Muslims found themselves trapped between the Nazi-allied Croatian Ustasha and the equally vicious Serbian ultra-nationalist Chetniks. With the conflict killing over one million in Yugoslavia, a few hundred thousand Bosnian Muslims, many of them civilians, perished. When Tito's Partisans emerged as a unifying alternative, Muslims joined them in large numbers. (For an extensive discussion of Bosnia during World War II, see Enver Redzic's "Bosnia and Herzegovina in the Second World War", Frank Cass: London, 2005).

The smearers don't like to talk about the Palestine Regiment, a British-organized volunteer force of Jews and Arabs that served in North Africa. They hardly mention the fact that hundreds of thousands of Muslim soldiers from Africa, India, the Soviet Union helped to defeat fascism at places like El-Alamein, Monte Cassino, the beaches of Provence, and Stalingrad. Historians and governments have only recently recognized the contribution of these soldiers to the war effort and to liberating Europe. The smearers aren't currently touting the American authorities' cruel, forced 1939 return from Miami to Nazi Europe of the Jewish refugee ship SS St. Louis. Or that elites in the Anglo-American sphere widely admired Adolf Hitler throughout the 1930s - George Bush's hero Winston Churchill first condemned Hitler only five years after he came to power. Or that elements of the Jewish and Zionist leadership collaborated with the Nazis - as documented by Hannah Arendt and other Jewish historians (who called their actions "the darkest chapter of the whole dark story"). Or that today, Israel ironically dangles the specter of Holocaust - in its Nuclear avatar - over the mostly Muslim peoples of the Middle East. The tragic history of World War II and the Holocaust is indeed a complex affair needing full context for understanding.

Holocaust heroes

In their perversion of memory, Holocaust zeroes share another moral ugliness. Both insult the memory of the countless Muslims who risked or gave their lives to rescue Jews threatened with extermination by the Nazis. The stories of the Muslim rescuers of Jews are largely unknown and unpublicized. Only in the past fifteen years have Holocaust researchers brought a few to the public's attention.

Several Muslims (whose stories of heroism and courage we know) have since been honored by Yad Vashem and other Holocaust memorial groups as Righteous Gentiles. They include: the Bosnian Dervis Korkut, who harbored a young Jewish woman resistance fighter named Mira Papo and saved the Sarajevo Haggadah, one of the most valuable Hebrew manuscripts in the world; the Turk Selahattin Ulkumen, whose rescue of fifty Jews from the ovens of Auschwitz led to the death of his wife Mihrinissa soon after she gave birth to their son Mehmet when the Nazis retaliated for his heroism; the Albanian Refik Vesili who - as a 16-year-old - saved eight Jews by hiding them in his family's mountain home.

Most Holocaust historians would agree that Muslim Europe - Albania, Bosnia, and Turkey - responded courageously and righteously, especially in comparison to Christian Europe. While there were Muslims who collaborated with the Nazis, they were the exception and certainly not the rule. In addition, in North Africa the Sultan of Morocco, the Bey of Tunis, and the Ulema of Algeria all lent support to their beleaguered Jewish countrymen.

Continental Europe's only independent Muslim country - Albania - was also the only European country to have a larger Jewish population at the end of the war than at the beginning, according to Miles Lerman, a former director of the US National Holocaust Museum. Harvey Sarner, a Jewish American in the Albanian Muslim response, penned the telling book "Rescue in Albania: One Hundred Percent of Jews in Albania Rescued from the Holocaust".

There were many Bosnian Muslims, especially in Sarajevo, who saved the lives of their Jewish compatriots. Indeed, the Jewish community in Sarajevo owed its very existence historically to the centuries-old Ottoman Muslim policy of providing sanctuary to Jews fleeing European Christian persecution.

Republican Turkey thankfully followed that same Ottoman tradition of rescue and sanctuary. Due to its neutrality during most of World War II, and its unique geographical proximity to both Europe and the Middle East, Turkey and Turkish diplomats living abroad played an important role for European Jews in danger during World War II and the Holocaust, according to the Anti-Defamation League. Muslim-majority Turkey rescued over 15,000 Turkish Jews and over 100,000 European Jews.

Like their Christian counterparts, the Muslim men and women who rescued Jews during the Holocaust are among history's true heroes, whose stories we should be telling our children and grandchildren. They represent the best of the Abrahamic and Islamic tradition and spirit. May God grant us true moral courage like the rescuers in the face of hardship and adversity. May God - the Most Compassionate, the Most Merciful - free us of denying or exploiting the suffering of others.

Great article! As the (Muslim) granddaughter of German-Jewish Holocaust refugees I find this new fad of denying the Holocaust very disturbing! The Muslim world tends to conveniently forget that much of the faith is underpinned by it's predecessors, Judaism and Christianity and that Semitic Jews and Arabs are genetic cousins (I've noted that many of my Arab friends share the same unrully, curly hair as I do).
On the other hand, coming originally from the US where Holocaust exploitation is rife, I find this very sanctimoneous and sacreligious. Having grown up under my grandparents' shadow and with their ghosts from Germany I really do believe that those who have no experience of what really happened should not be speaking on our (the families of Holocaust victims, survivors & refugees )behalf for their own gain.
People such as Pat Robertson and Billy Graham who continually push the public's buttons on this issue are really only exploiting it for their own aim which I believe is to grab all of Israel from the Palestinians and then once it is all in Israeli hands, the BOCs and WASPS will swoop down and exterminate all the Israelis and set up their Christian "Kingdom of God" in it's place.

The world should take the grotesque events of the Holocaust as a reminder of what can happen when history repeats itself and as a lesson for our progeny and leave history to tell its story!

Mas'ood: I seriously encourage you to take that story of the Bosnian who saved the lives of Jewish refugees and turn it into a full book-length story. I never knew of this and I'm sure there are many like me. These things have to be told.

Good suff. On sensitive issues like this, the author wisely criticizws both sides of the issue. I echo migocup; the stories should become a full-length book!

Yes, very good stuff and eye opening too.

Good article. Norman Finkelstein's "Holocaust Industry" is a must read on the use and abuse of it for political gains.

It is not enough to say that Islaam doesn't allow for such a thing as a holocaust. To say that the murder of 6 million non-muslim people with the participation or complacency of another non-muslim nation does not have a bearing on muslims because we had nothing to do with it, or simply because these a kuffaar, nasaras, yahudis... is wrong. Thank you for showing that this is the true intent of our Islamic tradition.

Thank you for highlighting the importance that muslims have to fight injustice whether it is against muslim or non-muslim (or even enemies). We cannot play into the hands of "civilizational clash" theorists by dividing the world conveniently into the ones we control and the ones we don't. Thank you for pointing out that muslims can in many cases do more as individuals as they can in a collective, simply because an individual muslim must do what he/she believes is right. Thank you for showing us that muslim heroism doesn't necessarily mean bearing arms.

What in informative article! Thank you! Could I have the source for your information on the "mufti"? I've encountered so many internet postings about him in the last year it's nausiating, and I'd love to have something to counter it.

This article has a number of errors, most of which are misleading statements that contain some truth but leave out the whole story. All of the facts below can be verified in Wikipedia or any other reference source:

First, the quote about "elements of the Zionist and Jewish leadership that collaborated with the Nazis" strongly overstates the case and makes it sound like there was widespread collaboration between Jews and Nazis. This is extremely misleading, and a disservice. The extremist group LEHI did indeed try to contact the Nazis in 1940 and 1941, before the Holocaust was known, to broker a deal to cooperate against the British in return for an independent country, but the article as written implies widespread cooperation, which just was not true.

Also, while Muslim countries deserve credit for the fact that they did not generally act against their Jewish populations, the article ignores some important times when they did. Tunisia was occupied by the Nazis and Jews were randomly killed and enslaved. Iraq's ancient Jewish population was targeted in a massive riot called the Farhud that left as many as 400 dead in 1941, and Tripoli had anti-Jewish riots that killed hundreds in 1945.

I don't see a huge reason to get into the Mufti argument but the defense you are offering is not correct either. The SS "Handschar" division did not mutiny en masse, only 14 soldiers did, and it had nothing to do with a desire to disobey orders. The unit also committed many war crimes and many of its officers were indited.

And as for Herbert Samuel selecting the Mufti, he was given a slate of five candidates by the Muslim leadership, and selected the Mufti, whose brother was Mufti before him -- and this was in 1921, before he became a Nazi sympathizer. And the Mufti turned into quite a Nazi Ò he actively attempted to poison Tel AvivÌs water supply, and gave notoriously inflammatory anti-Semitic radio speeches arguing that all Jews should be killed, among other such incidents.

Again, I understand your argument that the Holocaust should not be exploited, but you have made a lot of implications that are misleading.

Dear Friends,

Presumably we are looking for a diversity of views, other than those expressing condolence and acceptance (which any good Muslim will offer):

Some interesting excerpts from an article I read recently:

"I, Raquel Baranow am a Grad Student of Holocaust Denial. There are persons with PhD's in various fields who also deny the 6 million canard. The best evidence is forensic. Until recently, there was never a forensic examination of the alleged murder weapon (gas chambers). Demographic figures are incomplete. After the fall of East Europe to communism, many of the millions of Jews who fled Poland into the Soviet Union or ended up behind the Iron Curtain changed their names to assimilate, many civilians died in the war, many died in the concentration camps of louse-born typhus. During World War One, two million civilians in the Soviet Union died of typhus. Many died in Stalin's gulags.

Yad Vashem, a Holocaust Documentation Center in Israel has a database of 3,000,000 alleged victims of Nazi extermination. But as you can see HERE (my maiden name, Friedemann), nearly every name is listed at least twice, some as many as five times!

It is forensically impractical or impossible to exterminate millions with louse disinfestant (hydrogen cyanide gas) or diesel exhaust as alleged by malicious "witnesses" or tortured confessors. There are no written orders for extermination. Aerial reconnaissance photographs of the concentration camps show no smoke and flames belching from the crematoria and pyres as alleged. The photos and records show there was not enough coke or crematoria to cremate millions of corpses. The "witnesses" and confessors lied about how many minutes it takes to cremate a corpse. Diesel exhaust does not contain significant amount of carbon monoxide to kill a human. If the Nazis wanted to kill millions they could have driven the coal fired train into a tunnel or quonset hut and gassed 'em with the exhaust from the locomotive or used the exhaust from the crematoria.

(cont'd below)

"Lie #1: Mythologists, citing a Nazi document allege that 97,000 people were processed (i.e., "gassed") in three trucks during the course of five weeks. Irving understates "that is a very substantial accomplishment if you work it out with a
pocket calculator" (= 38.4 people/hr/truck, 24/7).

The NOVA producers edited out: "twenty people were processed [deloused/transferred?] per time [not 38.4/hr.] and they drove twenty kilometers [12.4mi.] into the countryside" (Lying About Hitler, Richard J. Evans, 2002, p.216).

Lie #2: Mythologists allege that 120,000 people/month could be cremated at Auschwitz. Again, Irving invites you to do the math: Assume that each cadaver weighs 125 pounds; crematoria can dispose of 150 lbs/hr., therefor, you would need 139 ovens working 24/7 to cremate 120,000 people/mo.

There were only 46 ovens at Auschwitz and the crematoria could not and did not operate 24/7. Irving points out: "it takes 30 kilograms of coke to incinerate one body -- it would take many trainloads of coke to incinerate 120,000 corpses.

"Aerial reconnaissance photos of Auschwitz do not show huge piles of coke." The same photos -- contrary to malicious, lying "witnesses" and tortured confessors -- show no evidence of smoke and flame belching from malfunctioning crematoria chimneys or huge aerodynamically inefficient smouldering cremation pits, where sizzling human fat was "scooped up in buckets." NOVA mythologists -- defying laws of thermodynamics -- declare only 3.5 kg of coke is necessary to cremate one corpse. (Lard, i.e., human fat = 8.4 kilo-calories/kg; coke has 3000 kcal/kg.)

Lie #3: Mythologists allege stupid, suicidal Nazis crudely dumped dangerous cyanide louse disinfestant (Zyklon B) through holes in the roof of the gas chambers. (If the Nazis were going to use Zyklon, they would have opened the cyanide canisters in a heated, easy to clean cabinet attached to a blower designed for a Zyklon clothing disinfestation chamber.

At Auschwitz, during typhus epidemics, 300 people died per day.) Irving points out there is no evidence of holes in the concrete roof of the alleged gas chambers.

No holes, no Holocaust.

For more information on the forensics of the Holocaust ... go to [url=http://www.vho.org."]http://www.vho.org."[/url]

** Just found it interesting, thought I would share it with you in the spirit of discussion ***

"Avenger" - you are not doing anyone any favors by quoting Holocaust denial crap. Irving, who you so lovingly refer to, was found by the courts to have fabricated data. In fact, its funny that you quote from Robert Evans, since he was a witness against Irving, and the passage you are giving (out of context) actually explains how he manipulated information to try to deny the Holocaust, it is far from a defense of his views.

Also, as for the "no holes, no holocaust" garbage, from the BBC:

Deniers have said for years that physical evidence is lacking because they have seen no holes in the roof of the Birkenau gas chamber where the Zyklon was poured in. (In some of the gas chambers the Zyklon B was poured in through the roof, while in others it was thrown in through the windows.) The roof was dynamited at war's end, and today lies broken in pieces, but three of the four original holes were positively identified in a recent paper. Their location in the concrete matches with eyewitness testimony, aerial photos from 1944, and a ground photo from 1943. The physical evidence shows unmistakably that the Zyklon holes were cast into the concrete when the building was constructed.

So please, stop.

Dear Tommy2,

Firstly, I am bitterly opposed to any form of oppression. Genocide, torture and persecution is abhorrent. Muslims know this as much as anyone.

I am sorry you found my post so offensive that you had to ask me to stop. So much for freedom of speech, debate and expression. Unless you follow a religion that says "talking about the possibility that the Holocaust was exaggerated", I can't see the offense.

It is not wrong for posters to have a debate on the issues, on the contrary it is to be supported. Asking people to STOP professing an opinion or sparking debate makes us part of the problem, not part of the cure. The excerpts are (if you read the first line) from "Raquel Baranow".

There are other, diverse opinions out there:

"Why are we told that me must 'never forget'? Why is Jewish suffering presented as being more unique and terrible than the suffering of any other people? The answer is simple. The Holohoax has become the most effective propaganda tool of World Jewry. It provides the Jew with a stick to beat the Goyim into submission with. It legitimises the bandit state of Israel and places the Jew on a moral pedestal so that no matter what crimes he may commit his position is unassailable."

Thats one for a start. Here's another:

"The Holohoax is also a huge moneymaking enterprise, an endless gravy train of "reparations" and Government grants to museums, foundations and 'tolerance' centres.

In an increasing number of European countries debate about the historical facts of the Holohoax has been criminalised ...Without it the whole rotten pack of cards would collapse within seconds. It would be impossible for us due to time and space constraints to present a comprehensive debunking of the Holohoax here so we urge the reader to do his own research. Here are some questions you might like to explore :-

Why,when the number of detainees who died at Auschwitz was cut from 4 million to 1.5 million by the camp museum researchers, was the total of 6 million not reduced accordingly? Where did the the extra 2.5 million dead Jews come from to keep the magic number at 6 million?

HOLOHOAX MATHEMATICS :- 6,000,000 - 2,500,000 = 6,000,000"

(see below)

"How can the 'confessions' from the Nuremburg War Crimes Tribunal be regarded as authentic when according to Allied doctors who examined the German prisoners many of them had been tortured? Why is the confession of the Auschwitz camp commandant written in English, a language he did not understand, and why are the pages spattered with blood?

How could the Germans have gassed one million Jews at Auschwitz in 'chambers' which could never have functioned? Why would these chambers be designed so that they would have discharged highly explosive and toxic Hydrocyanic gas right under the naked flames of the camp crematoria and next to the commandantsí quarters? Did the Germans wish to poison themselves and blow the entire camp apart?

Why did the Simon Wiesenthal Centre exhibit a photograph on its website showing smoke coming from a 'crematorium' which was in fact airbrushed on and was coming not from a chimney but a fence post?

Why do 'survivors' claim to have seen smoke and flames and ashes issuing from crematorium chimneys night and day when reconnaissance photos show no smoke at all and the blueprints of the crematoria show that the chimneys were fitted with flame and smoke traps?

If there was a Concentration Camp at Treblinka where 850,000 Jews were killed then why does it not appear on wartime reconnaissance photos - and why has a ground penetrating radar survey of the site revealed no foundations, no evidence of buildings and no bodies?

How did the Germans dispose of 1.1 million corpses at Auschwitz? The crematoria did not have anything like the capacity to dispose of this number.The alternative story of burning bodies in pits would have required so much petrol that the entire German war effort would have been paralysed. So how WERE the bodies disposed of?

How can 'eyewitness' tales of Jewish prisoners working as 'Sonderkommando' dragging bodies from the 'gas chambers' be true ? None of these stories mention gas masks and some even say the Sonderkommando were smoking cigarettes IN A CHAMBER FULL OF EXPLOSIVE POISONOUS GAS.

Why are so many 'survivors' tales, kept in museum archives, unavailable for public view?

If it is true that the Germans lined tens of thousands of Jews against what is called the 'shooting wall' at Auschwitz and blew their brains out then why can you visit this wall today and see for yourself that there are no bullet holes in it?"

It wasn't just Jews who were interred and exterminated in the concentration camps, the Nazis also targeded gypsies, the physically and mentally disabled, anyone who did not conform to their standard of the 'Arian' master-race.

I also find it ironic that while you are 'appalled' at the opinions expressed on this site you don't seem to have any qualms about expressing your own appalling opinions!

You should watch your language about Jews! Not all Jews are Zionists nor do they all support Israel and it's barbaric tactics! When you insult Jews you insult me and many other Muslim converts from Jewish backgrounds and most of all you are insulting the memory of my grandparents and many others like them who had to live through this dispicable horror!

For crying out loud! Mr/Mrs Muslim-Supremacist is just jealous that a different ethno-religious minority has lots of influence. He/she would love to see Muslims occupy such a role in the West. But, since they don't he/she tries to find ways to publicize misinformation and agit-prop to attack that ethno-religious group's primary claim for sympathy. Ever read Don Quixote? You know, the lone warrior on a romantic quest...a quest which is absolutely insane to onlookers. Yup, that's "Avenger"...

Nour78: The quotes I have pasted are food for thought. There are many questions left unanswered, or do you believe everything your Government tells you. There is NO QUESTION that there was oppression during the second World War, but to deny that there are too many serious unanswered questions does not help the situation. This thread relates to the Holocaust. It was about time there was a fair and balanced discourse about what happened. I can only offer my deepest condolences for any suffering experienced by your family but what actually happened should be YOUR quest as much as for others.

I appreciate this is an emotional subject for you but when you said "insulting the memory of my grandparents" how exactly have I done this?

IF the Holocaust was hugely exaggerated then how does this impact on the 'need' for the state of Israel and the US, UK and UN roles in its establishment and continuation. Do you mean to join those who gag free speech and any semblance of an inquiry into what occurred?

Churchill's mother was Jenny Jerome. She was Jewish. Her son Winston Churchill (in accordance to Jewish law, the son of a Jewish mother is a Jew) in his massive six-volume history of World War Two, and Eisenhower in his memoirs (totalling over 7,000 pages) both omitted any references to "gas chambers" and their use in an alleged "genocide" of the Jews. Even Emilie Schindler (Oskar's widow) said Spielbergís Schindler's List was full of lies. Although the German government kept extensive and detailed records of its wartime Jewish policy, not a single document has ever been found which substantiates or even refers to an extermination program or policy.

I trust you agree with the premise that Muslims have a responsibility NOT to perpetrate or cover up a falsehood:

"And cover not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth when ye know (what it is)" (002.042 Surat Al-Baqara [The Cow])

OmarG: There's no such thing as "Muslim supremacist". Islam has primacy but we are too accept all other faiths so long as they do not denigrate, oppress or attack us. Its not about ethnicity. I know is unfashionable nowadays... but it is purely and simply about the truth.

Avenger, I notice that as soon as I point out that your earlier claims ("no holes - no Holocaust," Evans quote, Irving, etc.) were obvious lies you simply drop the points entirely, attack me personally, and post more nonsense from the same site using the term "Holohoax"... that doesn't do much for your credibility.

Surffice it to say, your new Holocaust denial "facts" are just as ridiculous, and require willful disregard of information. On the disposal of bodies: The amount of ash produced in the cremation of a person is about a shoebox full, and disposing of it was not difficult. Aerial photographs of Auschwitz indicate that some ash was piled into the nearby river and marsh, and there is well-documented evidence that other ash was used as fertilizer in nearby fields. Photographs of Treblinka taken by the camp commandant show ash piles being distributed by steam shovels.

Similarly, the "Auschwitz plaque" was never used by any scholar to calculate death totals of the Holocaust, it was a random Soviet claim that nobody else took seriously. If you read any book written by any scholar on the subject for the last 60 years, the death totals at Auschwitz have been consistant at 1-2 million. Seriously. You can read more here.

Are you getting the theme here? The points from VHO (which is an anti-Muslim organizaiton too, btw) which you keep quoting are obvious lies that require willful ignorance of actual historical facts. You can read more information about this at Wikipedia, Nizkor, or any other site you would like, but please stop posting BS.

Argh, while I was in the process of posting my last note, you put together the most blatent lie of all: "Although the German government kept extensive and detailed records of its wartime Jewish policy, not a single document has ever been found which substantiates or even refers to an extermination program or policy."

This is just plain stupid. There are huge amounts of such documents from Nazi sources. Take a look at the thousands of pages of Einsatzgruppen (SS killing squad) reports, that document the killing of well over a million Jews in open air shootings. You can <a href-"http://www.einsatzgruppenarchives.com/jager.html">see the original documents here</a>, along with lists of Jews killed in each town recorded by the Nazis themselves.

Or what about the Wannasee Protocols, that laid out the master plan for the Holocaust, and was recorded by Adolf Eichmann? Or the Hoefle telegram, which proudly reports the number of Jews killed in camps in 1942 (1,274,166)? There are thousands of these documents, as any Google search or visit to your library will tell you.

If you are going to try to deny the Holocaust, at least make your lies more subtle.

"And cover not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth when ye know (what it is)"

Tommy2: You said "you simply drop the points entirely, attack me personally" -Please point out when I attacked you personally.

This is misinformation.

You also said "The points from VHO (which is an anti-Muslim organizaiton too, btw) which you keep quoting" - I have not referred to any VHO work yet.

This is misinformation.

Look at the information in its entirity: Churchill's mother was Jenny Jerome. She was Jewish. Her son Winston Churchill (in accordance to Jewish law, the son of a Jewish mother is a Jew) in his massive six-volume history of World War Two, and Eisenhower in his memoirs (totalling over 7,000 pages) both omitted any references to "gas chambers" and their use in an alleged "genocide" of the Jews. Even Emilie Schindler (Oskar's widow) said Spielbergís Schindler's List was full of lies. Although the German government kept extensive and detailed records of its wartime Jewish policy, not a single document has ever been found which substantiates or even refers to an extermination program or policy.

There are simply too many questions unanswered. We could argue the evidence ad infinitum and ad nauseam.

Within 5 minutes of looking at the *unresolved* evidence, any fair minded individual would agree there are serious flaws in the case. What will "history" show about the Iraq war? Will Bush and Blair be remembered and revered as heroes of Democracy, will the text books in front of children in 2166 tell the real truths that many of us are aware of today. Neither Churchill nor Eisenhower made any reference AT THE TIME to genocide, "gassing" camps, or millions of deaths at the hands of the Nazi's... not even using war time reconnaissance or within 7,000+ pages of "The History of World War Two" which should be looked at with Eisenhower's memoirs in 1958 for the complete picture.

Its a big thing to "miss" wouldn't you agree? There are too many common sense questions unanswered.

Don't perpetrate misinformation. Its not an attack, its just a simple fact.

"You can fool some of the people some of the time and all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time" (Abraham Lincoln)

Funny, Avenger:

You said that there was no Nazi documentation of the Holocaust -- I gave you links to thousands of pages of documentation from the Nazis themselves listing millions of Jews killed.

You said that Robert Evans supported Irving -- I showed you that exactly the opposite was true, as any Google search would indicate.

You said that there were no insertion points for poison gas in the gas chambers -- I gave you links to wartime recon photos, ground photos, and papers showing these holes, and there are pages of Nazi documentation as well talking about gas chambers.

You said the ash couldn't be disposed of - I pointed out that there are pictures taken by the Nazis and Allied recon planes showing ash being removed.

You said that the Auschwitz plaque somehow challenges the number of Jews killed -- I demonstrated that this is a willful lie not supported by any historian, none of whom used the Auschwitz plaque for any sorts of calculations.

You said you didn't use VHO information -- YET THE VERY FIRST LINK YOU GAVE WAS TO VHO, which you quoted.

And what is your response to all of this? Nothing, nada, zip but a quote from the Koran, and something about Churchill's mother. Why won't you defend any of your points?

Probably because Holocaust denial requires an ignorant audience - if you know anything at all about the Holocaust, the stupidity of the lies of Holocaust denial and the evil of its motivations is obvious.